• SMETS 2 and switching energy suppliers

    I have a Pure Planet second generation smart meter.

    If in the future I switch to another supplier who does not yet support smart meters, will the meter still show Pure Planet as my supplier and will the tariff be updated in the meter? What will or won't work on the In Home Display at that point?

    If I have different suppliers for gas and electricity, how does the smart meter system cope with this?

    Thanks!
    Tap below to see the best answer
    0
  • I have a Pure Planet second generation smart meter.

    If in the future I switch to another supplier who does not yet support smart meters, will the meter still show Pure Planet as my supplier and will the tariff be updated in the meter? What will or won't work on the In Home Display at that point?

    If I have different suppliers for gas and electricity, how does the smart meter system cope with this?

    Thanks!
    Tap below to see the best answer


  • Best Answer

    Thanks @woz for bringing in the experts

    You're right, SMETS2 meters are designed to be fully inter operable with all domestic UK suppliers. All UK suppliers were mandated to be DCC Users by November 2017 but unfortunately there are still a lot out there that are incapable of servicing them.

    This doesn't mean that your meter won't continue to function if you switch but it does mean that the smart capability will no longer be useful (i.e. the new supplier won't be able to obtain remote readings and they won't be able to change the settings on the meter; your IHD will therefore just display the old details - prices and supplier information).

    Most suppliers would leave the IHD in situ rather than replacing with their own (there are only really 2 manufacturers anyway so chances are the new supplier is using the same display device as the previous one). The IHD isn't actually the one that contains the information so there would be no point in replacing the unit because the information is pulled from the meters (it is that which needs to be overwritten by the incoming supplier). As you say @woz - very wasteful.

    Regarding the point about shared suppliers - the system was absolutely designed for this very purpose (so consumers have the choice of having both fuels with the same or different suppliers). In this regard the suppliers 'share' a display device and the IHD will just pull the information from their respective meters as updated by the suppliers independently. They could give you an IHD each but that would be a bad customer experience as you would have to know which one was your gaz and which your leccy.

    Hope that helps.
    Remember to point all your smart meter queries my way
    0
  • Thanks @woz for bringing in the experts

    You're right, SMETS2 meters are designed to be fully inter operable with all domestic UK suppliers. All UK suppliers were mandated to be DCC Users by November 2017 but unfortunately there are still a lot out there that are incapable of servicing them.

    This doesn't mean that your meter won't continue to function if you switch but it does mean that the smart capability will no longer be useful (i.e. the new supplier won't be able to obtain remote readings and they won't be able to change the settings on the meter; your IHD will therefore just display the old details - prices and supplier information).

    Most suppliers would leave the IHD in situ rather than replacing with their own (there are only really 2 manufacturers anyway so chances are the new supplier is using the same display device as the previous one). The IHD isn't actually the one that contains the information so there would be no point in replacing the unit because the information is pulled from the meters (it is that which needs to be overwritten by the incoming supplier). As you say @woz - very wasteful.

    Regarding the point about shared suppliers - the system was absolutely designed for this very purpose (so consumers have the choice of having both fuels with the same or different suppliers). In this regard the suppliers 'share' a display device and the IHD will just pull the information from their respective meters as updated by the suppliers independently. They could give you an IHD each but that would be a bad customer experience as you would have to know which one was your gaz and which your leccy.

    Hope that helps.
    Remember to point all your smart meter queries my way


  • Dunno but that is a wicked user name ๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ‘
    Peace is always beautiful.

    WALT WHITMAN
    3
  • Dunno but that is a wicked user name ๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿ‘
    Peace is always beautiful.

    WALT WHITMAN


  • ha- if you think you're going to get any serious answers with a username like that think again!

    Smets2 meters are designed to be capable of interoperability between suppliers. That means in theory, when you move to a new supplier they should upload their own info to the meter.
    That would overwrite PP's.

    โ€‹All suppliers are required to have offered their customers a smart meter for gas and electric by the end of 2020 and anyway which supplier doesn't support smart metering?
    (A bit of a cop-out reply I don't know the answer and you raise an interesting point, presumably the branding remains until overwritten but it's almost academic, so what you're asking is once you leave shouldn't the old supplier make the meter agnostic as you leave? Sounds like a recipe for disaster) @MrSmart where are you?

    โ€‹Regarding the IHD, if it's been designed properly it should continue to work with the new meter, if the data fields are standardised which they should be, but whether it will is anyone's guess at this point. *See below
    My guess is that a lot of companies will send a new IHD (I hope not - wasteful) It's a good question, do you feel like asking the Trio IHD manufacturers?
    www.geotogether.com e:- customerservices@geotogether.comIf you ask nicely they may be able to incorporate a fartmeter section into future models.

    In theory you should be able to have separate gas and electric suppliers*

    *I'll believe it all works when someone who is in that situation posts back and tells me it's all working OK or I've seen evidence, In the meanwhile I'll assume nothing will work properly.
    Not a helpful answer sorry.



    Quote Originally Posted by fArtMeter View Post
    I have a Pure Planet second generation smart meter.

    If in the future I switch to another supplier who does not yet support smart meters, will the meter still show Pure Planet as my supplier and will the tariff be updated in the meter? What will or won't work on the In Home Display at that point?

    If I have different suppliers for gas and electricity, how does the smart meter system cope with this?

    Thanks!
    0
  • ha- if you think you're going to get any serious answers with a username like that think again!

    Smets2 meters are designed to be capable of interoperability between suppliers. That means in theory, when you move to a new supplier they should upload their own info to the meter.
    That would overwrite PP's.

    โ€‹All suppliers are required to have offered their customers a smart meter for gas and electric by the end of 2020 and anyway which supplier doesn't support smart metering?
    (A bit of a cop-out reply I don't know the answer and you raise an interesting point, presumably the branding remains until overwritten but it's almost academic, so what you're asking is once you leave shouldn't the old supplier make the meter agnostic as you leave? Sounds like a recipe for disaster) @MrSmart where are you?

    โ€‹Regarding the IHD, if it's been designed properly it should continue to work with the new meter, if the data fields are standardised which they should be, but whether it will is anyone's guess at this point. *See below
    My guess is that a lot of companies will send a new IHD (I hope not - wasteful) It's a good question, do you feel like asking the Trio IHD manufacturers?
    www.geotogether.com e:- customerservices@geotogether.comIf you ask nicely they may be able to incorporate a fartmeter section into future models.

    In theory you should be able to have separate gas and electric suppliers*

    *I'll believe it all works when someone who is in that situation posts back and tells me it's all working OK or I've seen evidence, In the meanwhile I'll assume nothing will work properly.
    Not a helpful answer sorry.



    Quote Originally Posted by fArtMeter View Post
    I have a Pure Planet second generation smart meter.

    If in the future I switch to another supplier who does not yet support smart meters, will the meter still show Pure Planet as my supplier and will the tariff be updated in the meter? What will or won't work on the In Home Display at that point?

    If I have different suppliers for gas and electricity, how does the smart meter system cope with this?

    Thanks!


  • ha- so basically, it should work in theory but it probably won't...(which is what I said)
    Also (I'm not pressing you here but you are the expert) the question about what SHOULD happen once a customer leaves, and assuming the meter is not yet re-written by the next supplier, and thus contains the original suppliers info hasn't been answered at all. Does the system allow the original supplier or indeed mandate the original supplier to remove their info from that meter? I appreciate as I said this is somewhat academic but interesting nonetheless.
    I'm guessing that the original question was rather more concerned with what info the meter would use (isn't that the whole point of Smets2?) rather than it working as a smart meter which is one of the most basic points of Smets2, or are we all being lied to?
    ( @Marc this should be moved to the ask your SM technical questions thread even though there don't seem to be any definitive answers?)
    I think this whole smart meter project should be renamed...
    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmart View Post
    Thanks @woz for bringing in the experts

    You're right, SMETS2 meters are designed to be fully inter operable with all domestic UK suppliers. All UK suppliers were mandated to be DCC Users by November 2017 but unfortunately there are still a lot out there that are incapable of servicing them.

    This doesn't mean that your meter won't continue to function if you switch but it does mean that the smart capability will no longer be useful (i.e. the new supplier won't be able to obtain remote readings and they won't be able to change the settings on the meter; your IHD will therefore just display the old details - prices and supplier information).

    Most suppliers would leave the IHD in situ rather than replacing with their own (there are only really 2 manufacturers anyway so chances are the new supplier is using the same display device as the previous one). The IHD isn't actually the one that contains the information so there would be no point in replacing the unit because the information is pulled from the meters (it is that which needs to be overwritten by the incoming supplier). As you say @woz - very wasteful.

    Regarding the point about shared suppliers - the system was absolutely designed for this very purpose (so consumers have the choice of having both fuels with the same or different suppliers). In this regard the suppliers 'share' a display device and the IHD will just pull the information from their respective meters as updated by the suppliers independently. They could give you an IHD each but that would be a bad customer experience as you would have to know which one was your gaz and which your leccy.

    Hope that helps.
    Remember to point all your smart meter queries my way
    0
  • ha- so basically, it should work in theory but it probably won't...(which is what I said)
    Also (I'm not pressing you here but you are the expert) the question about what SHOULD happen once a customer leaves, and assuming the meter is not yet re-written by the next supplier, and thus contains the original suppliers info hasn't been answered at all. Does the system allow the original supplier or indeed mandate the original supplier to remove their info from that meter? I appreciate as I said this is somewhat academic but interesting nonetheless.
    I'm guessing that the original question was rather more concerned with what info the meter would use (isn't that the whole point of Smets2?) rather than it working as a smart meter which is one of the most basic points of Smets2, or are we all being lied to?
    ( @Marc this should be moved to the ask your SM technical questions thread even though there don't seem to be any definitive answers?)
    I think this whole smart meter project should be renamed...
    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmart View Post
    Thanks @woz for bringing in the experts

    You're right, SMETS2 meters are designed to be fully inter operable with all domestic UK suppliers. All UK suppliers were mandated to be DCC Users by November 2017 but unfortunately there are still a lot out there that are incapable of servicing them.

    This doesn't mean that your meter won't continue to function if you switch but it does mean that the smart capability will no longer be useful (i.e. the new supplier won't be able to obtain remote readings and they won't be able to change the settings on the meter; your IHD will therefore just display the old details - prices and supplier information).

    Most suppliers would leave the IHD in situ rather than replacing with their own (there are only really 2 manufacturers anyway so chances are the new supplier is using the same display device as the previous one). The IHD isn't actually the one that contains the information so there would be no point in replacing the unit because the information is pulled from the meters (it is that which needs to be overwritten by the incoming supplier). As you say @woz - very wasteful.

    Regarding the point about shared suppliers - the system was absolutely designed for this very purpose (so consumers have the choice of having both fuels with the same or different suppliers). In this regard the suppliers 'share' a display device and the IHD will just pull the information from their respective meters as updated by the suppliers independently. They could give you an IHD each but that would be a bad customer experience as you would have to know which one was your gaz and which your leccy.

    Hope that helps.
    Remember to point all your smart meter queries my way


  • Yes, it does work when switching supplier the problem is that some suppliers aren't ready but are working on it.

    What should happen isn't set in stone. The only thing that is is for the losing supplier to ensure that the meter is in credit mode (it's a license condition) so that customers don't get stuck in credit mode. The rest is down to business practice. Some suppliers will set the price to zero on their loss but it's not mandated to. Other than that the supplier phone number, name and the tariff configuration will remain on the meter between suppliers.

    The IHD will continue to calculate usage based on the tariff that remains on the meter (whether that's a 2 rate, 20 rate or single rate electricity tariff) and perhaps zero price.

    Not sure what you're referring to when you state "are we being lied to"?

    Quote Originally Posted by woz View Post
    ha- so basically, it should work in theory but it probably won't...(which is what I said)
    Also (I'm not pressing you here but you are the expert) the question about what SHOULD happen once a customer leaves, and assuming the meter is not yet re-written by the next supplier, and thus contains the original suppliers info hasn't been answered at all. Does the system allow the original supplier or indeed mandate the original supplier to remove their info from that meter? I appreciate as I said this is somewhat academic but interesting nonetheless.
    I'm guessing that the original question was rather more concerned with what info the meter would use (isn't that the whole point of Smets2?) rather than it working as a smart meter which is one of the most basic points of Smets2, or are we all being lied to?
    ( @Marc this should be moved to the ask your SM technical questions thread even though there don't seem to be any definitive answers?)
    I think this whole smart meter project should be renamed...
    0
  • Yes, it does work when switching supplier the problem is that some suppliers aren't ready but are working on it.

    What should happen isn't set in stone. The only thing that is is for the losing supplier to ensure that the meter is in credit mode (it's a license condition) so that customers don't get stuck in credit mode. The rest is down to business practice. Some suppliers will set the price to zero on their loss but it's not mandated to. Other than that the supplier phone number, name and the tariff configuration will remain on the meter between suppliers.

    The IHD will continue to calculate usage based on the tariff that remains on the meter (whether that's a 2 rate, 20 rate or single rate electricity tariff) and perhaps zero price.

    Not sure what you're referring to when you state "are we being lied to"?

    Quote Originally Posted by woz View Post
    ha- so basically, it should work in theory but it probably won't...(which is what I said)
    Also (I'm not pressing you here but you are the expert) the question about what SHOULD happen once a customer leaves, and assuming the meter is not yet re-written by the next supplier, and thus contains the original suppliers info hasn't been answered at all. Does the system allow the original supplier or indeed mandate the original supplier to remove their info from that meter? I appreciate as I said this is somewhat academic but interesting nonetheless.
    I'm guessing that the original question was rather more concerned with what info the meter would use (isn't that the whole point of Smets2?) rather than it working as a smart meter which is one of the most basic points of Smets2, or are we all being lied to?
    ( @Marc this should be moved to the ask your SM technical questions thread even though there don't seem to be any definitive answers?)
    I think this whole smart meter project should be renamed...


  • Thanks MrSmart I realise my reply may have read somewhat harshly, not intended. It wasn't personal!

    The are we being lied to wasn't directed at you! It was a general comment aimed at the now accepted wisdom that all smets2 meters would continue to function as expected when a change of supplier takes place, unlike the debacle that was smets1.

    Perhaps I misunderstood your reply when you wrote
    "This doesn't mean that your meter won't continue to function if you switch but it does mean that the smart capability will no longer be useful (i.e. the new supplier won't be able to obtain remote readings and they won't be able to change the settings on the meter; your IHD will therefore just display the old details - prices and supplier information).
    My point was that the whole point of Smets2 was precisely that there should be (an "effectively") seemless transition between suppliers.
    โ€‹

    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmart View Post
    Yes, it does work when switching supplier the problem is that some suppliers aren't ready but are working on it.

    What should happen isn't set in stone. The only thing that is is for the losing supplier to ensure that the meter is in credit mode (it's a license condition) so that customers don't get stuck in credit mode. The rest is down to business practice. Some suppliers will set the price to zero on their loss but it's not mandated to. Other than that the supplier phone number, name and the tariff configuration will remain on the meter between suppliers.

    The IHD will continue to calculate usage based on the tariff that remains on the meter (whether that's a 2 rate, 20 rate or single rate electricity tariff) and perhaps zero price.

    Not sure what you're referring to when you state "are we being lied to"?
    0
  • Thanks MrSmart I realise my reply may have read somewhat harshly, not intended. It wasn't personal!

    The are we being lied to wasn't directed at you! It was a general comment aimed at the now accepted wisdom that all smets2 meters would continue to function as expected when a change of supplier takes place, unlike the debacle that was smets1.

    Perhaps I misunderstood your reply when you wrote
    "This doesn't mean that your meter won't continue to function if you switch but it does mean that the smart capability will no longer be useful (i.e. the new supplier won't be able to obtain remote readings and they won't be able to change the settings on the meter; your IHD will therefore just display the old details - prices and supplier information).
    My point was that the whole point of Smets2 was precisely that there should be (an "effectively") seemless transition between suppliers.
    โ€‹

    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmart View Post
    Yes, it does work when switching supplier the problem is that some suppliers aren't ready but are working on it.

    What should happen isn't set in stone. The only thing that is is for the losing supplier to ensure that the meter is in credit mode (it's a license condition) so that customers don't get stuck in credit mode. The rest is down to business practice. Some suppliers will set the price to zero on their loss but it's not mandated to. Other than that the supplier phone number, name and the tariff configuration will remain on the meter between suppliers.

    The IHD will continue to calculate usage based on the tariff that remains on the meter (whether that's a 2 rate, 20 rate or single rate electricity tariff) and perhaps zero price.

    Not sure what you're referring to when you state "are we being lied to"?


  • Thank you all for your replies.

    โ€‹The situation is pretty much as I expected.
    0
  • Thank you all for your replies.

    โ€‹The situation is pretty much as I expected.


  • I agree, depressing isn't it...
    That said all the energy companies are in the same boat, another fine IT project run by the government.
    โ€‹I think it will come right eventually at several times the budget...
    Quote Originally Posted by fArtMeter View Post
    Thank you all for your replies.

    โ€‹The situation is pretty much as I expected.
    0
  • I agree, depressing isn't it...
    That said all the energy companies are in the same boat, another fine IT project run by the government.
    โ€‹I think it will come right eventually at several times the budget...
    Quote Originally Posted by fArtMeter View Post
    Thank you all for your replies.

    โ€‹The situation is pretty much as I expected.