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Smart meter


I waited in for the engineer to fit my smart meters, my appointment was today between 1pm-5pm, at 16.32 I got a call from Magnum saying they cannot attend !
grrrrrr !!!!!!!!
Not happy !!!!!!!
You must have some compensation process ?
please get in touch.
really very unhappy !!!!!!
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Dr Sanjeev Devgan
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Best answer by Nataly 13 January 2020, 10:55

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Lets continue to deviate - my boiler was losing pressure a couple of weeks ago on a daily basis - so called the service company who swiftly arrived. Re pressurised the tank/system and left. A few days later same same and another engineer arrived and replaced the pressure release valve. So the first visit treated the symptom and the second visit the cause which a member of the family had originally suggested.
I get my old focus regularly serviced and I say again (been a constant problem) keeps revving up for no reason in stationary traffic - gets worse again a few weeks after the service. So I go back and they spray some stuff down the air thingy and lots of sh.. splurges out. They advise that I use the higher octane petrol which has solved the problem as when I switched back to regular octane (not supermarket) petrol the problem returned. Its a funny old life and the objective (which lacks lots of motivation) of a getting another vehicle is now on hold until I can get out to see what piece of plastic and metal meets my unknown criteria - car counselling may be needed and I should need a few sessions.
An update. PP eventually came back to me to say that it is OK for me to remove the earth wire before the Magnum man (I thought Magnum was a choc ice on a stick!!) arrives and put it back when he has gone! Different to the last Magnum engineer who said if I did that he could not install the meter yet he was unable to provide a logical reason. When the current bug crisis is over time will no doubt tell when they call back for the third time.

This behaviour seems to be mirrored in the current crisis when some policemen and others are interpreting guidance on going out in their own way and adding restrictions that are not there. We should remember that Guidance is not law and in my previous life it was not unusual to come across Government Guidance that was not correct. I wrote to the Home Office once to advise them to rectify and they certainly did not like that! There was no way they would admit they could possibly be wrong. As luck would have it I met some senior officials and a legal expert in the field (licensing law) at a training session. I mentioned the point to them. The Guidance was rapidly changed. Why is it those in the public sector find it difficult to admit to a mistake and when things go wrong we get the standard “lessons will be learned from this”! Hey, I have deviated!
PP have behind the scenes run this as a complaint for me and now come back to say the reason the wire cannot be removed and replaced is nothing to do with competency but “The reason that they cannot move earth bonding is because it is not the supplier's equipment”.

That does not make sense. Of course the earth wire does not belong to the supplier it belongs to the house owner. I can authorise it’s removal and replacement, I can do it myself but Magnum won’t accept that. That is to say they will not accept the owner of the equipment doing it or giving authority for it to be done. Yet PP in their reply imply that Magnum would have the qualifications, if such are needed to do it. The answer is a simple one, the owner, in this case me, gives authority if need be. But no somebody has got their knickers in a twist by not thinking it through.

Of course the supplier is PP!

My water supply comes from Northumbrian Water. I have an earth wire attached to the cold water feed, as do many many properties, Magnum’s approach, if they were plumbers, would be they cannot do plumbing work for the earth wire is there.

One answer I suppose is buy an earth rod, drive it into the ground and then attach the wire to that. Not as good an earth as the existing one.

Sorry, but common sense is very much lacking here. But then sense is not common.
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have a read of THIS
and THIS

Duppy;49957:
Hi G4HRL
I'm sorry to hear of your ongoing issues, I'm struggling to understand how an earth wire can prevent installation, unless the earth lead is sitting directly on top of the connection.
​​​​​​​My gas meter does not have an earth tag, it is in the incoming water pipe fitted eons ago. The installer fitted a label saying no earth tag present
Userlevel 7
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Hi G4HRL
I'm sorry to hear of your ongoing issues, I'm struggling to understand how an earth wire can prevent installation, unless the earth lead is sitting directly on top of the connection.
​​​​​​​My gas meter does not have an earth tag, it is in the incoming water pipe fitted eons ago. The installer fitted a label saying no earth tag present
Thanks. I have heard and PP are now addressing this as a complaint. It points to PP should never have chosen Magnum to do the work for (a) they are not qualified to complete it all and (b) don’t have the equipment. My type of earthing is very common. It is an excellent way of doing it.

It seems i now have to wait some more months whilst the Magnum engineers attain the relevant qualifications and they acquire the equipment/testing gear in order to do the job they are appointed to do.

It has been suggested I employ an electrician but why should I pay for that when the installation is free? But then Magnum still could not do the work as it seems the Magnum engineer is required to test the earthing when he is finished and he can’t for they don’t have the right gear.

It must be costing Magnum a fair bit with abortive visits as I know I am far from being alone with this issue.

In the interim I suppose I must go to University to learn how to undo a screw, take off a cable and put it back again. I assume it is a 3 year course. Will I get a grant?
Hi @G4RHL

Just to let you know I've moved your posts into this thread, as keeping everything in one place avoids multiple replies to the same issue across the Community - this can get confusing!

As far as we're aware, the engineers cannot move the earth wire. Apart from anything else, this is an issue of liability if something goes wrong, rather than the physical issue of actually moving it.

I'm really sorry this means your gas meter hasn't been installed yet - I'd advise to contact an electrician to carry out the earth wire works before the Magnum engineer attends.

The issue is being raised with Magnum to investigate further, as it's understandably frustrating they've now attended twice. You should hear from our Member Services team via email about this 👍
I have posted elsewhere on this but Magnum again could not install the smart meter. Same reason and he was not allowed to let me do it. It seems that despite being chosen as an approved installer Magnum are not equipped with respect to expertise and equipment to do the job.
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They failed to plan - bound to fail - very slack indeed.
The modern age of communication nobody speaks to anybody! Magnum called this morning, the second visit, to fit the smart meter to the gas supply. As I have reported before, they called in January and could not do it because the earth strap is fastened to the pipe. The engineer advised he needed to go on a course. I was advised to make contact again if I had not heard in a month. I did and I stressed that whoever calls needs to be qualified to wield a screwdriver to undo the circlip, take the earth wire off, change the meter and then put it back on again.

Appointment made for this morning, a different engineer attended. I saw him at the door looking at his phone. He had just read the email that advised him about the earth cable. He could not do it, nor could he let me do it as he understands he is responsible for the job!

So still not done despite Magnum knowing for two months what was needed. This chap went a little further to say that they have to check the earthing after fitting but Magnum don’t have the small testing device to do that.

So I have to wait again. Whilst clearly Magnum don’t read what is sent to them they are also not equipped to do the job yet have been chosen as the appointed installer!
I am likely to do what you say but having recently had a minor operation care is needed bending over!

As for bills I imagined the delay is the change over but puzzled as to why it should be an issue.
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Gerry Sweeney;49732:
So when are PP rolling out the new Smart Meters?


Hi Gerry,

Welcome to the community.

Got this link by scrolling through through all the smart info.....in the above smart meter menu..think its a good starting point
https://community.purepla.net/threads/8690-A-look-back-at-2019-and-the-world-of-smart-meters

Review all above posts and revert back as lots of members ready to assist...
So when are PP rolling out the new Smart Meters?
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Hi @G4RHL
As I said in your previous post, if you are able I would take the lead off myself and refit it later, although you shouldn't have to, but at least you would be sure that the meter was changed
​​​​​​​As regards your statement issue, there is often a delay in receiving statements after meter changes. After mine were fitted I didn't receive a statement for five months
A further update on the installation of my gas smart meter. In January the engineer could not install it because he had not been on the training cause that tells one how to take an earth strap off and put it back. The installation was to be rescheduled. Reminders had to be sent to get it moving and they made it clear the right engineer needed to attend. This resulted in a booking for this coming week. I sent a message to ensure he or she would be able to do the job and received a reply that seemed to be a general one and not specific to me to say that the installer cannot move the earth wire but I could get this done or do it myself! I am waiting to hear if that is a mistake! I don’t think this is a PP issue but a Magnum one they being the chosen installers but it is a PP person who responded to me. I will report in later in the coming week.

In the interim I have had no bills from PP since January and my credit is building up in the account.
Delighted to say I have progress. After working out how to navigate the system of raising questions in the app, that is a very long way off being obvious or intelligently thought through, never mind not knowing when you may have reply, I eventually broke through the barrier to the other side. A bit like Dr Who crossing the boundary to get to Galifray! My gas smart meter is being installed next week. I do hope the engineer comes with a screw driver to relocate the earth strap. It makes you wonder what must have seriously gone wrong somewhere for the moving of an earth strap to have become such a big issue. My guess is somebody took it off and failed to put it back on correctly!

My Electric Smart Meter works OK. A bonus seems to be PP have stopped sending my bills now! They have not stopped debiting my bank account though!
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I switch things off for the fun of it but inevitably it ends badly....
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Duppy;46630:
Hi G4HRL
Welcome to the weird and wonderful world of smart meters, you are right it won't save you any money, I'm sure like me, you only use the energy you need, and don't turn things on for the fun of it.
Your IHD may in time settle down, and so to will the constant checking of usage, and if your family are anything like mine, they don't even look at it.
You will find , on battery power it will only last about 3 hours, and there is no warning they are running low, so best to keep it plugged in.
i hope you get your gas meter sorted soon and your remaining SM experience is uneventful
Regards
​​​​​​​Duppy
Userlevel 7
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Hi G4HRL
Welcome to the weird and wonderful world of smart meters, you are right it won't save you any money, I'm sure like me, you only use the energy you need, and don't turn things on for the fun of it.
Your IHD may in time settle down, and so to will the constant checking of usage, and if your family are anything like mine, they don't even look at it.
You will find , on battery power it will only last about 3 hours, and there is no warning they are running low, so best to keep it plugged in.
i hope you get your gas meter sorted soon and your remaining SM experience is uneventful
Regards
​​​​​​​Duppy
As a Smart Meter newbie, well 50% newbie, I await the gas meter, I am intrigued by the read outs on the display panel. It may be I see odd readings because it is settling in, it was installed 3 days ago, but they are odd. I can understand the green, amber and red and I expect it to show red when a tumbler drier, washing machine is on, but a lot of the time during the daytime it stays in green showing a cost of between 3p per hour and 6p. During the night it drops to 1p per hour. If that is right then I am pleased for fridges and freezers are still on as also is the power to all my Hue bulbs even though the lights are not on. But what is strange is that the needle often sits in the amber section yet I am told the running cost is say 4p per hour. Other times 4p per hour shows in the green section. I accept there will be a time delay whilst it catches up with what may be switched on but after watching it for some time, 5 minutes or more, it stays amber even though I know nothing is switched on other than perhaps my computer. Early days of adjusting perhaps?

It is a pain to get the back off to put batteries in! I have to assume that when the PSU provides power it bypasses the batteries for there is no warning about leaving batteries in other than not to use rechargeables, and that will be because of their lower voltage.

I have to say though that by taking the panel to the appliance and switching it on you can quickly see what it costs. You also see the cost going up and down if the appliance is a washing machine or dishwasher when it needs to heat incoming cold water. It won't save me money though!
There is a bigger safety risk taking the meter out and fitting a new one. Removing and reattaching an earth strap is something I am sure anybody can do, but..... Sounds like someone must have cocked up a simple job at some time.
Hi @G4RHL

In these cases we'd advise to get in touch with an electrician, who can sort the wiring out ready for your gas installation. It's not a very common issue but unfortunately it does crop up sometimes.

The Magnum engineers are prohibited from detaching the earth wire due to the safety risk, if something went wrong!

Magnum should contact you to rearrange the installation. If you haven't heard anything in a couple of weeks, get in touch with our Member Services team and they'll be able to chase this up for you.

Glad to hear that the electricity installation went well at least 😁

Fingers crossed for the gas meter! Let us know how everything progresses. 🤞
He knew what to do, I knew what to do but he had to report it in as Magnum will not let him touch it without training. I accept some training may be needed in using a screwdriver to undo a clip and reattach it, I accept there is a jobsworth mentality here, I accept that companies are petrified of things not being done right, but what I cannot accept is the lack of common sense. But then sense is not common.

If you are qualified to disconnect and remove an old meter, to install a new one, to check the home circuit is OK, including earthing (all of which he did) then he has the qualifications to move the earth strap. No, some jobsworth has decreed training is needed, despite sufficient knowledge and training already having been effected. It keeps people in employment I suppose but ultimately at our expense. There will now have to be another visit to install the gas meter. He hinted I may not hear and if I have not in a month to get in touch with PP about it!

Some government idiot once said smart meters save money, whilst he was not only wrong on that, he omitted to say that with this behaviour they cost us money.

i also asked the installer what upgrades at been done to the wireless network, for not so many months ago Magnum said they could not install a Smart Meter because of a weak signal in my area. He knew of none!

Anyway, I now have a little screen telling me what electricity I am using! One day it may tell me about gas.
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Strutt G;46393:
Just a small point Duppy as advised by engineers when we had our gas mains updated.
The existing pipe remains in situ and engineers thread through the new plastic pipe.
But I guess that could be dependant on the existing infrastructure from area to area.

Agreed Strutt G, that's what they do, but in my case ( and I assume others ), they had to cut a large piece out because they couldn't navigate through a 90 degree bend. At most 40-50 cm of original pipe left before the gap, and next door had their meter moved, plastic all the way.
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Just a small point Duppy as advised by engineers when we had our gas mains updated.
The existing pipe remains in situ and engineers thread through the new plastic pipe.
But I guess that could be dependant on the existing infrastructure from area to area.
Userlevel 7
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Hi G4HRL
​​​​​​This has popped up before about earth bonding on gas pipes. I have had numerous visits to replace my gas meter, but on the last visit the engineer attached a large label about the lack of bonding ( it on the water pipes ), but never actually said anything.
​​​​​​​What I can't understand though is that Cadent have been replacing the gas pipes from mains to premises with plastic pipes, so how does the earth bonding work?.
​​​​​​​Just a thought, why not remove the clip yourself and refit it after the meter change

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