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Dual meter

  • 20 November 2020
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My landlord has advised me I should have a dual rate meter installed. I actually have a single rate meter. Who is responsible for changing this?

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Best answer by TonyHoyle 20 November 2020, 20:04

Unless you can shift most of your consumption to night use E7 isn’t likely to save you very much, and may even be more expensive as the day rate is increased to make up for the cheaper night rate.

I would expect nobody installs dual meters any more - it’ll just be installing a smart meter configured for dual (or multi) rate instead.

 

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17 replies

My landlord has advised me I should have a dual rate meter installed. I actually have a single rate meter. Who is responsible for changing this?

Hi @LisaC 


Pure Planet don’t supply ‘dual rate’ electricity, so if you have a SMETS 2 meter which has been installed by Pure Planet, it will be set to single rate. If Pure Planet stop being the provider to your property, the new provider will be able to change the settings ‘over the air.’

The above information is based on the assumptions:
That Pure Planet installed a ‘Smart Meter’ in your property. 
That by stating you need a ‘dual-rate meter’ you have Economy 7 in some shape or form.

Should those assumptions be incorrect, as I am after all not psychic, further clarification of who has installed what meter would be helpful.

Kindest Regards

Gwyndy
 

Userlevel 1

We do not have a smart meter.

 

Userlevel 1

My landlord has said that my bill should be alot cheaper once I've changed it too a dual meter.

So I should be changing to a provider than does offer this? 

My landlord has said that my bill should be alot cheaper once I've changed it too a dual meter.

So I should be changing to a provider than does offer this? 

Hi @LisaC 

Unless you have Economy 7, Economy 10, TwinHeat, or WhiteMeter, as your electricity package from your previous provider  - or something else that takes advantage of ‘off-peak electricity’ installed (such as an electric vehicle charger, brand new storage heaters), your bill would probably not be ‘cheaper with a dual meter’ using most ‘ordinary’ Electricity Providers.
Simply because ‘Dual Rate’ meters are intended to operate with separate consumption readings for ‘peak’ and ‘off-peak’ electricity.

Are you attempting to take advantage of ‘Feed in Tariffs’ (new applications for which ended last year) using a solar PV array? As the Landis & Gyr E110 is designed to be used with solar PV arrays.

Without knowing why your landlord claims your bill should be alot cheaperit’s difficult to offer much in the way of advice, perhaps a ‘Smart Meter’ would help, but why it needs to be ‘dual rate’ needs clarification. 


Kindest regards
Gwyndy

 

Userlevel 7
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hi @LisaC 

Your supplier along with the dno is responsible, it’s not just a case of the meter being changed (it would need to be changed in your case), but also the supplier has to designate the supply as mpan as two rate.

Before you head off down that route and change suppliers I’d take a deep breath - are you able to offer any clarity on why your landlord thinks that to be the case? Does the landlord know anything about when you consume your energy? If so how is that the case?

My advice if PP refused to change you to dual rate supply (and it would make sense for them to refuse since their tariffs only have a single rate) would be to change to a provider who did offer E7 and ask them, but as I said there is no clarity at this stage as to why or if it would be of benefit.

Are you charging an electric vehicle at the property?

 

Userlevel 1

Thank you very much for your very informative reply.

My landlord was advised by an electrician that we should of had dual meters put in. We have solar panels that heat our water (with a boost button function that we have to use at least twice a day, because ....well....its scotland)  and electric radiators. No gas. I don't think we use most our energy at night we don't have storage heaters either. No electric vehicles. 

I'm not sure who...(or how) I need to ask? 

Userlevel 3

Unless you can shift most of your consumption to night use E7 isn’t likely to save you very much, and may even be more expensive as the day rate is increased to make up for the cheaper night rate.

I would expect nobody installs dual meters any more - it’ll just be installing a smart meter configured for dual (or multi) rate instead.

 

Userlevel 7
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@LisaC 

I wonder if we have crossed wires here (pardon the pun) and THIS is what he was alluding to?

and also

https://www.solarpowerportal.co.uk/news/seg_ofgem_details_guidance_on_data_the_fits_register_and_storage_exports_fo#

I’d have a word with the electrician and see what exactly he had in mind and why.

Userlevel 1

I think I'm going to have to go back to my sources for more information, it doesn't seem to be making sense. Thank you for that link, I've no idea if this is what he was talking about but i will show it and ask him. 

I don't think we are connected to the grid though, im unsure how I would work that out! We are in a group of 16 new build houses, we only have two solar panels per house and some days it doesn't even generate any hot water! 

Thanks again for you advice everyone 😀

Userlevel 7
Badge +10

Unless you can shift most of your consumption to night use E7 isn’t likely to save you very much, and may even be more expensive as the day rate is increased to make up for the cheaper night rate.

I would expect nobody installs dual meters any more - it’ll just be installing a smart meter configured for dual (or multi) rate instead.

 

@TonyHoyle I know someone who recently had an upgrade to single supply, (from dual) and they were able to have a dual rate non-smart meter fitted by e.on, but as you say it might be a different story if you start from single supply single rate. Given that suppliers still offer E7 tariffs and you aren’t obliged to have a SM, it’s an interesting point, and I’d like to know the answer.

Userlevel 7
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I think I'm going to have to go back to my sources for more information, it doesn't seem to be making sense. Thank you for that link, I've no idea if this is what he was talking about but i will show it and ask him. 

I don't think we are connected to the grid though, im unsure how I would work that out! We are in a group of 16 new build houses, we only have two solar panels per house and some days it doesn't even generate any hot water! 

Thanks again for you advice everyone 😀

YW. You are connected to the grid (unless you move into the forest and go off-grid:sunglasses: )

Userlevel 1

This is our set up, he had said something about there being two tails one for if I remember correctly for heating our water and one for everything else in the house.

Perhaps we are suppose to be generating energy for the grid? 

I'm sure we need an export meter in there somewhere aswell. 

I will keep you posted. 

Userlevel 3

Normally you have an export meter with solar - although with only 2 panels it’s unlikely you’d export anything to be honest.  I also don’t see an isolator for the inverter (because if the solar is generating power switching off at the incoming switch might not be enough to ensure no power in the house, you have to be able to isolate it).

Maybe you actually have solar water heaters not panels?  That would explain the lack of anything in that picture.  OTOH it would make the suggestion of two meters even wierder..

 

 

Userlevel 1

Yes, I think you are right we have solar water heaters. Not panels my mistake! 

 

Userlevel 1

So ive spoken to the electrician. 

He says we should be on a dual tariff as our heating has a separate mains board to our other electricity needs.

So we have two mains boards and one is all heating and that should be charged at a lower rate, but not eco 7 because they don't heat at night. It should be a 24 hour tariff. With two meters to read both separately. 

Anybody ever heard of this tariff? It doesn't feel likely im going to find a supplier?

 

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@LisaC

Lisa I’m a bit confused, help me out here, I think we’ve sort of (ugh i hate that phrase) gone full circle here...

What sort of heating do you have, does it come on during the day and does it have some sort of storage and stay hot for a long time after it’s switched off?

Similarly when does your water heat up at the moment?

I’m asking these questions because..

E7 gives you 7 hours of off-peak electricity somewhere between 22:30 and 07:30 (times vary according to DNO area not according to supplier)

If one of your systems like the hot water can be timed at the cheap rate then it might be feasible, you could fit a timer for the hot water. If your heating isn’t the stored heat variety an off peak scheme isn’t as suitable because it would need to be on during the day.*

The first question to be asked, and it’s worthy of following up, is how much of your electricity do you use during the day and how much of it could be “migrated” to night rate. 

(*It’s also worth remembering that anything else that’s using energy will be at off-peak rate when off-peak rate applies)

@Nataly why is this marked solved?

Userlevel 3

That sounds like the old dual meter setups.. those are *old* - used to live in a place with them, it was a nightmare because you have to pay two standing charges even if you never used the underfloor heating that was connected to the second meter.

 

I also never found an electricity company that could deal with them on a separate rate, either.  It was hard enough to find one that could handle the concept of two separate meters at all..

 

You really don’t want one of those.

 

 

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